Guest Posted August 12, 2004 Share Posted August 12, 2004 So did you all watch the program about nurseies this evening? It was very sad to watch those poor babies being abused in such a way. We all know it goes on but to sit and watch it was very alarming. I do feel they missed a vital opportunity though to show the good side of child care by not broadcasting the nursery that she had worked at that was good. But, as always, it's only the bad stuff that the media feels is newsworthy. I must say though that OFSTED came in for a fair amount of critisism too and rightly so. I think most of us have suffered at some point at their hands and it needs to raise standards too. And it was obvious from the program that parents are kept pretty much in the dark about what OFSTED are up to at times. I feel very sorry for parents who put their trust in nurseries and pre-schools/playgroups only to find that that trust has been abused along with their children. We just have to let them know that these settings are in the minority and the rest of us do a very good job and have high standards that WE set, not just OFSTED. Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted August 12, 2004 Share Posted August 12, 2004 Couldnt agree more Linda, I put out a parent survey at least once a year and rely on the feedback I get this way more than on what Ofsted say. If the parents are happy or unhappy I can respond quicker than having to wait for the Ofsted inspection and subsequent report (our last report took 5 months to reach us). I also actively encourage parents to spend time with us during a session so that they can see everything we do. A spot check is a daunting thing but I'd rather that than let places like those we saw tonight continue. I hope those poor children get over their experiences but I'm not so hopeful that the nursery workers that were sacked wont get employment in another setting though. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 12, 2004 Share Posted August 12, 2004 I saw the programme and I was horrified to see such awful things happening and felt so sorry for those parents. They must feel such immense guilt but until they knew they could do nothing. I agree with you two, they REALLY should have shown the good side of things, show what a fantastic place a nursery/pre-school can be, but like you said, this doesn't make good TV. I know how little OFSTED in schools really sees of the real school. I laughed reading the report for the school I worked at as an NQT as they wrote about SMT and what specific members of staff did/had done. I KNEW it wasn't a true reflection, but it's what they see. We are due OFSTED in October and already everyone is deciding what they will be doing then, and yes, everyone wants to be seen at their best, but with so long to prepare, so much can be done. I know that if they turned up next week unannounced they'd still see what a great school it is I work at, so I for one am all for drop-in inspections. Sorry, end of ramble. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1027 Posted August 13, 2004 Share Posted August 13, 2004 It was abosolutly horrific........ God help those of us who can honestly say that we run ours professionally and i for one would welcome drop in inspections..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 13, 2004 Share Posted August 13, 2004 Thanks Dianne, Lorna, Linda, Rea, Nichola, Sue.R. and Hali for your welcome. I too taped the programme last night, ( had a night out, and lye- in, bliss). As I half expected, the staff were mainly young, underpaid, undervalued, un-managed and overstretched. Their behaviour was of course unacceptable and changes thankfully can, and have been, be put in place immediately- including dismissal!!! The comment on OFSTED's Inspections failing parents was interesting, In my experience I do feel that the responsibility of checking quality is down to the parent, with Ofsted as a guide, because they inspect to the minimum requirements. Debate on this site re: Quality Assurance schemes, self assessment and reflection of practice has recognised this issue. I always encourage prospective parents to visit more than once, without appointment (open door policy) and to visit other settings in my area, because we all offer subtle different types of services. For example I am based in a large hall, that has shared use, yet another local site offers a converted home with four quite small rooms. It is the parent who would know, through visiting both, with their child, which physical aspect of each setting would best suit their childs previous experience, personality and character. My hubby thinks this is "not good business sense" sending parents to the competition, but at the end of the day it is what is best for the child and family. I wonder how many of the staff shown in the programme are aware of the birth to three guidance. ( Did anyone notice the worksheets (finger painting activity) and the line of "identical" craft pieces displayed on the wall??? Peggy. p.s. please advise me if my comments are too long to digest as previously stated I am new to using this form of communication???? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted August 13, 2004 Share Posted August 13, 2004 The comment Fiona Bruce made about the member of staff doing paperwork and not interacting with the children gave me a little concern. I've told my management committee that I would love to be able to spend all of my time playing but with so much paperwork to do, I sometimes have to do it during a session (especially when my hubby hates me doing for no pay at home). It's not an ideal situation and we as a team make sure paperwork is done quickly and as little as possible on the premises. The programme didnt explain what paperwork was being done, it could of been the accident book or some observations being written up. I dont think this was helpful especially as this is just the kind of thing a parent will notice and presume we are not doing our job. Cant wait for the start of term Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 13, 2004 Share Posted August 13, 2004 I can see where you are coming from Rea. I think many of us take some time to write up observations etc. at our settings. I think the problem on the program was that the member of staff seemed to be on her own with the children, other than a volunteer, and she was doing the paperwork when she should have been with the children. Peggy you are right about it being the responsibility of parents to ensure that the setting is the right one for their child. But, as shown in the program, it is all too easy to pull the wool over somebody's eyes and be on your best behaviour when visitors are around. We too have an open door policy and very, very rarely ask parents to make appointments. But it was obvious from the reaction of parents last night that they had no idea what was going on. And it is impossible for young children of that age to tell parents what is happening. Let's hope this will be a wake up call for those nurseries and pre-schools that think they can get away with poor practice. Linda Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 14, 2004 Share Posted August 14, 2004 It sounds fascinating - and horrific! I wish I could have seen it. Does anyone have any links to articles? Was it a BBC documentary? Title?? I'd love to read more. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3307 Posted August 15, 2004 Share Posted August 15, 2004 There's also a piece about it in the observer today (p14). One observation I have to offer to the debate is that I have often been approached by secondary schools for work experience placements in the nursery class. These often seem to be the lower ability children (i know this because often they were pupils in our school too) who haven't got anything in mind for a career, except vaguely to work with "little children". They often come in thinking this is an easy option, and fairly often give up when they discover how intense and demanding and also repetitive working with small children can be. I could see reflections of some of them in the young people who were apparently qualified, working in those nurseries, but who seemed to have a total lack of enjoyment in the worlds of babies, toddlers and young children. No empathy, no understanding, no love for the children in their care. But why?? Was it poor working conditions? Low pay? no career structures? no CPD? a lack of emotional maturity? Low self esteem? that made them like that? There seemed to be such low morale running through all of them that maybe in a way it becomes inevitable that their frustration coupled with little real understanding of children's development maybe comes out in that distressing way. It also makes me sad that all the hard work that goes on in so many settings will be tarnished by this programme. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2732 Posted August 15, 2004 Share Posted August 15, 2004 It's taken me a while to add to this thread, as I was severely shaken by the programme. What you say catma rings very true. What distresses me most of all, as a NN currently working in a busy Day Nursery, is your last point. The staff team I work within are, everyone of them, dedicated, hard-working, caring, loving and supportive. Of each other, as well as the children and their families.The Directors of our two Nurseries are themselves caring, supportive and dedicated to the children, families and staff, making a business feel like a family. It is a joy to work within this environment and it grieves me deeply to think of the damage that could be caused by this programme to us and others that work like us. I most sincerely hope that thought is given to presenting the other face of the situation. Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_64 Posted August 15, 2004 Share Posted August 15, 2004 Nicola, I didn't see it either as I was away. It was a BBC program and here is a link to the story. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2732 Posted August 15, 2004 Share Posted August 15, 2004 Thanks for the link, Carol. Makes me feel slightly more charitable towards the Lizz person. Suppose the final format of the programme wasn't her fault, but it's a shame there wasn't more made of her few positive comments. Sue Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1027 Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 Hi Nicola I think the daily mail did a big two page spread on it one day last week. As i said the program should have shown both sides.... 3 good nurseries too to balance it up. (you cant have a one sided debate...can you!) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 To raise morale, I've just watched the film "Daddy Daycare", on Sky Box Office. Eddy Murphy and friend decide the local standard of childcare is unnacceptable and set up their own, with hilarious results. However the underlying message is that children come first, have a valid opinion and know what they want- love and security. Then learning will follow. A lovely feelgood film, has anyone else seen it? Peggy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted August 16, 2004 Share Posted August 16, 2004 I watched a video of the programme on the BBC web site, as I too missed it the first time around. I sat opened mouthed! I could have wept for the poor children. Nicola, did you find the link I sent you? I don't know how long they keep the video option open on the site, I think it's until the following week. Trea xxx Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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