AnonyMouse_705 Posted January 18, 2010 Posted January 18, 2010 Hi Today one of my colleagues read the story 'Little Red Riding Hood' whilst being assessed for her NVQ. All fine, no problems. Now she asked me if she should change the ending... the woodsman killed the wolf with his axe. I considered this and said I thought not because it's a Ladybird book for children, and I felt the children would be happier knowing the nasty wolf had been killed. Now the assessor said she would normally change the ending for something like that, perhaps gloss over the killing bit. My colleague didn't get marked down, because she had sought and taken the advise of her manager. Out of interest what would you have done?
AnonyMouse_1195 Posted January 18, 2010 Posted January 18, 2010 I would have told it as it is in the traditional version and always have done. I would do the same with Jack and the Beanstalk where the giant dies at the end.
Guest Posted January 18, 2010 Posted January 18, 2010 I despair whenever I hear anything like this. I, and I'm sure many here, were told the traditional version from an early age. Did it turn me into a disturbed child? Did I weep and wail and have nightmares? No, certainly not! It's not like you're telling them, "and then the woodcutter slit the wolf's throat and blood poured out..." What on earth do people think they're protecting the children from? I clearly remember when I got slightly older hearing and reading 'nicer' versions of the story and being cross because they were wrong; I certainly felt that the nasty wolf being killed was a much better ending all round - in fact my favourite ending was the one where the woodcutter sewed stones into the wolf's stomach and he fell into the river and drowned. These are traditional stories which have been told for years and so far children have coped fine with hearing them, I think changing the endings to make them 'nicer' is a bit of an insult to this generation of children. Pass me the cotton wool someone, the little darlings might hurt themselves or, heaven forbid, hear something nasty! Sorry I'll get off my soapbox now, this is one thing that really irritates me!
AnonyMouse_8623 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Yes I'd have told the true traditional ending too.
AnonyMouse_12960 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Perhaps in the future these over protected children will need the endings to all other classic films and books changes....just think how different Macbeth would be....or Angela's Ashes.....even love story!!!! Perhaps this cotton wool wrapped generation will just stay watching Peter Pan and Bambi for the rest of their lives? Oh no, perhaps not Peter Pan (they will be far too upset at the idea of babies becoming seperated and lost from their parents...oh perhaps not Bambi...won't be able to cope with mummy being shot. What can these poor overprotected children read?????? Quick lets start a campaign!!!!! (Sorry just couldn't resist a rant!!)
AnonyMouse_1195 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 I totally agree with everything said. Children need these stories where they can confront uncomfortable things in a safe and secure environment. Children don't seem to take them literally they know that they are stories/fairy tales. In these stories 'good' triumphs so it is something they can deal with.
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 I talking about this a few days ago with my son. We were discussing various Disney films, the old ones were scarey and had proper baddies, the new ones are fluffy and funny and bland. It never hurt me or my children to be thoroughly scared by traditional stories either. We used to have the complete works of the Brothers Grimm.
AnonyMouse_1195 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Me too I loved the Grimm's Fairytales. I still have my battle-scared copy next to my Winnie the Pooh, all loved and scribled in in parts A story isn't really all that good is it if there isn't some sort of conflict and overcoming of troubles? We all love a baddy .....think of pantomimes.
Guest Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Oh, for goodness sake! Would they suggest we re-write Bible stories, too? Just gloss over the crucifixion, plague of locusts, floods... I'm not particularly religious myself but where would you draw the line? I mark Rememberance Day with my children - should I not be mentioning war? Surely they should give our children, and those who work with them, a little credit?! Nona
AnonyMouse_3735 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 traditional ending.. as others... it is a story and children do know that... they are quite capable of understanding... Inge
Guest Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Concider the films that children can describe that they really shouldn't have seen! And computer games! The number of times I've had children tell me about their new game where you have to kill the baddies, they're unshockable. OK so that's not all of the children I teach, but in my area the majority of children see worse things happen on the TV or at home than could ever happen in a children's story book! And I remember the version where the woodcutter sews rocks into the wolf's tummy!!
AnonyMouse_19782 Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Mmmm sounds like the ending to the Grimms brothers tale, The Wolf and the Seven Young Kids, the mother goat finds all her little kids wriggling in the wolf's tummy still alive, so she fills his tummy with rocks instead and he drowns
Guest Posted January 19, 2010 Posted January 19, 2010 Isn't part of the idea behind such stories that a moral is taught - the good guys win in the end. With help and perseverence wrongs are righted. good over evil. Surely, forewarned is forearmed, or something like that.
AnonyMouse_705 Posted January 21, 2010 Author Posted January 21, 2010 Thank you all for your responses. I should have more confidence in myself! But I guess it is not a bad thing to reflect on our practice either individually or as a team! Thanks again.
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted March 15, 2011 Posted March 15, 2011 We read the stories in their traditional version as well as modified ones. Then the children get to compare them. They even create their own because they see it has been possible to do so. It gives them the courage to be more creative and you see it when the role-play in the outside area. They also take the time to think about morale issues. For example, even though the giant was not a nice one, Jack wasn't also a saint... LOL. They talk about respecting each others properties, no matter how the other person behaves.
AnonyMouse_11396 Posted March 15, 2011 Posted March 15, 2011 Yes agree with previous posts, definetly wouldn't change the text. Funnily enough i had a parent reviewing a storybook her child had chosen to take home to share. It was the bad tempered ladybird. She felt it was too agressive, but the moral was if you are grumpy, miserable and not nice it doesn't get you anywhere. Now how do i explain that to a teacher/parent.
Guest Posted March 17, 2011 Posted March 17, 2011 I agree, you should read it as it is. Imagine in a few years time when one of the children in your class is able to read the book themselves. How annoyed would they be if they discovered that you'd made up your own ending?! Whenever I'm teaching about traditional tales I like to try and find as many different versions of the story as I can to share with the children so they can compare the different endings etc and discuss which they like best and why. Usually they like the ones where justice is served at the end and the baddie dies! As others have said, we were all brought up with the proper endings and we're alright! And what about Tom and Jerry and the roadrunner?? You couldn't get much more violent than that! This discussion has made me wonder whether the fact that children's behaviour seems much more erratic now than it used to be is partly due to the fact that they don't get taught the lessons that we did from those stories. We were taught that if you do something bad you die horribly. Now children are taught that if you do something bad and you're sorry and feel guilty everyone can make friends again and it'll all be fine. That might be more realistic but it's not as scary and probably isn't as effective at dissuading children from being horrid! Am I looking too deeply into this?!
Guest Posted March 18, 2011 Posted March 18, 2011 (edited) I agree that stories should be told as they are written, as already said, part of what we are passing on is tradition. It is also a form of socialisation into the culture, in the way that the message passed on in the story is that if you do something wrong, that is not accepted in society, you are punished. However, having said that, I was retelling the story of the old lady who swollowed a fly to a child in a 2-3 year 'room' (no book), and I must say I felt very uncomfortable about saying the part " ... perhaps she'll die", so I didn't, I said "...perhaps she'll fly", (it was a spontaneous moment and stopping to ask a permanent staff's opinion was not an option at the time) I have at home a story bag containing the book and props and as the child asked for the story a few times, I've promised to bring the story bag in (will ask staff first of course). Now I'm currently working as agency support, and although I will now be working in this setting one day a week for a couple of months, I do not yet know the children very well, or the setting ethos, so part of my decision to change the ending was simply that. But, are your thoughts the same here - and... what IS the message in the story, is it that it's foolish to eat such things? or does it have a link with over eating? Or is it simply a 'nonsense' story/song with lots of lovely rhyme (which is why I love it) Edited March 18, 2011 by Guest
AnonyMouse_2127 Posted March 18, 2011 Posted March 18, 2011 It's the same with............... "There was an old woman who lived in a shoe". Would you change the bit where ..........."she whipped them all soundly as sent them to bed" to ........... "She hugged them all fondly and sent them to bed" ?? I saw this on a couple of websites when I was looking up Nursery rhymes. Sue J
AnonyMouse_30937 Posted March 18, 2011 Posted March 18, 2011 Interesting discussion, but did you know that in its original form, Red Riding Hood gets into bed with the wolf and the wolf eats Granny and Little Red Riding Hood, with no happy ending. The Red cloak is said to be a symbol of wanton female as in prostitution, and red riding hood gets into bed with the wolf who represents a father figure and is all to do with Oedipus complex apparently, and women mixing with the wrong types. Telling that version would certainly set the cat among the pigeons! However, woodcutter cutting off bad wolf's head, great fun and no worse than pigs letting the wolf fall into boiling water. Nothing wrong with a little fear.
AnonyMouse_3307 Posted March 19, 2011 Posted March 19, 2011 Well, if they didn't get killed we'd be overrun with big bad wolves. Cx
Guest Posted March 19, 2011 Posted March 19, 2011 ............but we are Catma, they're called politicians !! I agree read original and other versions, children have a voice and they can decide which ones they prefer. Children do need safe, secure environments to be able to feel and express fear, concern, chat about and/or role play around the different moral issues. We shouldn't molly coddle or underestimate children's ability to cope with such information, especially as it is given by people they trust. Peggy
AnonyMouse_3307 Posted March 19, 2011 Posted March 19, 2011 ............but we are Catma, they're called politicians !! laugh.gif ph34r.gif HA HA!! Cx
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