2 Days From Hell - Really Just Need To Let It All Out

[Guest]

Hello,

 

what a couple of day's (maybe its karma or somthing since i had monday off and have friday booked off, perhaps someone somewhere thought my short working week should be horrendous!)

 

anyhow .... arrived to work tuesday to find manager off sick , which was ok because i was out of ratio;'s so could cover office. 11 am a child got a temperature of 39.1 , our policy is that we call an ambulance when temperature is that high (is this policy in any of your settings????) so ambulance called and mum called and child cared for whist waiting... lots of chaos. upset child, upset mum and anxious staff (myself included although i did not show it!) Lots of paperwork to complete afterwards... crazy day, although thankfully child okay (bar ear infection, throat infection and chest infection but he was allowed home from hospital) .... got home had lovely evening with fiancee and friends and thought nothing more of the day.

 

got to work today, still no manager, but again okay because i could cover it. 2pm, i get informed that another child has a temperature 40.1 again ambulance called, mum and dad called etc.... another set of anxious parents and staff. by the time the ambulance came the child's temperature was too high to be read by the thermometer (very scary!). off to hopsital for that child......mum phoned later and the child has a viral illness, she is okay too and home now..... more paperwork filled in and literally no time to stop over the last two day's.

 

i then e-mailed someone higher in our company to let them know two ambulances had beeen called in two day's per our policy and got a reply saying that if ambulances were not available we could always consider using a taxi. I am not sure about this. Although i realsise that the ambulance service is not to be used wrongly i don't think it is my call as a deputy to decide whether an ambulance or a taxi is needed!. also a taxi would need two staff to go when only one needs to go in the ambulance.... plus surely the statement contradicts our policy anyway, when it says an ambulance MUST be called for temperatures above 39.0

 

sorry all, just needed to vent and now need a large glass or wine!

 

can you advise me on your policy re sick children with temperatures.

 

thanks

 

Dawn

[AnonyMouse_8457]

Bless you

 

I think there's something going on - maybe the moon? I've been low and felt so so tired and stressed, my teenage daughter has been moody - and isn't usually and commented today that several of her friends have felt the same and the staff at work have all been 'not themselves' this week too. Very odd!

 

 

Anyway, we don't have an ambulance policy. We call a parent/emergency contact if they have a temperature. If it was really high and we couldn't get hold of the parent we would probably call our local surgery as they have a paramedic there. We have a consent form to contact medic in emergency but no real policy on when this would be done - something to think about though...

[AnonyMouse_11396]

Oh poor you, I would definetly call an ambulance for both of these, and not a taxi, obviously contacting parent/carers too.

Unfortunately as we know children can quite quickly become very ill and then recover almost as rapidly. If in doubt always call for help.

Glad to hear there going to be okay, and would certainly discuss this with the powers that be regarding ambulance/taxi scenarios.

Now put your feet up and enjoy your glass of wine i think you deserve it.

[AnonyMouse_11396]

Sorry also meant to add that in discussion with your boss, manager it maybe useful to point out that an ambulance carries life-saving equipment unlike a taxi.

[AnonyMouse_11396]

Sorry also meant to add that in discussion with your boss, manager it maybe useful to point out that an ambulance carries life-saving equipment unlike a taxi.

[Guest]

We call parents for children with high temps. If we cant get hold of parents or emergency contacts we whip them up to A&E, we are fortunately within hospital grounds.

 

The child then can't return to nursery until 24 hours after the temperature has returned to normal and stabilised.

 

Seems to me you followed your policy to the letter so don't beat yourself up about it. As others have said a taxi would require 2 members of staff and don't carry life saving equipment. And you policy states that if an ambulance isnt available then call a taxi; wellan ambulance was available so there was no need to call a taxi.

 

Try to relax and have a large glass of wine.....and chocolate!

[AnonyMouse_3139]

What a week!!

Our policy says we will call an ambulance if we feel the child isnt responding to meds (i.e inhaler) or deteriorates, but we dont have a temp. example in it. Maybe we should?

I'm sure it didnt bother the ambulance service or the hospital, better safe than sorry.

Enjoy your wine

[Guest]

I have never called an ambulance for a high temp either.

 

We usually call parents.

 

I would obviously dial 999 if the child was desperately ill with the temp or we couldn't get parents.

 

I am not sure how I feel about this policy of ambulance if temp over 39, because yes it is very high but for some children they might not be as ill as another whose temp is say 38.8.........

 

I don't know!!

 

Maybe its too early for my brain.

 

No ambulance policy for us though!

[AnonyMouse_64]

You might find this helpful

 

http://hcd2.bupa.co.uk/fact_sheets/html/fever.html

 

In it it states

 

You should contact your GP or go to hospital if your child:

 

* is unusually sleepy

* has an unusual rash

* has a stiff neck

* has difficulty breathing

* has had a febrile convulsion (particularly important if it lasts longer than five minutes)

* doesn't seem to be getting better after a febrile convulsion

* has more than one convulsion, one after another

 

Your child might not have any of the above symptoms, but may just not appear to be 'right' or behaving as they usually do.

 

Call for emergency help if you feel it necessary.

 

Always seek medical advice if your child develops a fever soon after an operation, or after recently returning from foreign travel.

 

I think a fever on its own, without any other signs of illness, is not a good indicator of when to call an ambulance. As has already been stated, each child will have its own 'normal' temperature and it is a sudden and pronounced rise in this which would be worrying. However, if a child usually has quite a high temperature then what you are recording may well just be a small rise.

 

Personally I think the policy should be to monitor closely whilst waiting for the parents to arrive and only to call the emergency services if the child seems to take a very sudden turn for the worse. Also, at numerous First Aid training courses they always say that you should call an ambulance and wait rather than trying to take them yourself. If something happened en route this could have serious implications for staff members.

[AnonyMouse_2418]

Our policy is if temp is raised the parent/contact called , and child monitored until they arrive , if there is a further complication such as convulsions or suspect rashes then we would call an ambulance, and inform parents. Children can spike a temp for quite minor things and within half an hour be fine . And if a child attends hospital following injury illnesss at Nursery or ambulance is used etc every time a RIDDOR form and incident report for OFSTED is completed, in the last week we have had 7 children spike temps as there is a virus around, ( along with the winter vomiting one) imagine the paperwork that would generate!

[Guest]

From your post it seems the email did say 'if an ambulance was not available', not 'instead of' Presumably if you called the ambulance service and they said they had none available and you felt it was a real emergency you would want to get the child to medical care as soon as possible rather than waiting for an ambulance to become available (assuming a paramedic couldn't come either). Could this be what they might have meant? I've never come acorss a situation where I was told there was no ambulance/paramedic available to come to an emergency, does this actually ever happen? In an emergency I would agree that a taxi is not really a suitable alternative!

 

It does seem a strange policy though and one which is causing you, staff and parents anxiety. Would there have been the same level of stress and anxiety had it just been "oh x's temperature is quite high and she doesn't feel very well, let's call mum"? If you didn't have this policy do you really think either child was displaying severe enough symptoms that you would have ever considered phoning an ambulance for them? Of course it's always better to be safe than sorry, but this does sound to me rather like a blanket policy which isn't allowing staff to use good judgement and is instead sending everyone into a panic.

[Guest]

Yep, lots of paper work i would imagine

 

 

 

Our policy is if temp is raised the parent/contact called , and child monitored until they arrive , if there is a further complication such as convulsions or suspect rashes then we would call an ambulance, and inform parents. Children can spike a temp for quite minor things and within half an hour be fine . And if a child attends hospital following injury illnesss at Nursery or ambulance is used etc every time a RIDDOR form and incident report for OFSTED is completed, in the last week we have had 7 children spike temps as there is a virus around, ( along with the winter vomiting one) imagine the paperwork that would generate!

[Guest]

I completely agree. The policy does cause more anxiety. and in both cases i wuld not have called an ambulance if it hadn't said in the policy. Basically both sets of parents arrived before the ambulance (and both within 5 minutes of being phoned!) it caused so much undue anxiety to the parents, staff and child. I can see why the company has a 'blanket' policy (we are a large company!) and they clearly want to set guidelines, but i fear this is excessive and that a statement along the lines of 'continually monitor the child until the parent arirves' would be better, only phoning an ambulance if the child took a turn for the worse or if parents were going to be a long time coming.

 

Dawn

 

 

 

 

From your post it seems the email did say 'if an ambulance was not available', not 'instead of' Presumably if you called the ambulance service and they said they had none available and you felt it was a real emergency you would want to get the child to medical care as soon as possible rather than waiting for an ambulance to become available (assuming a paramedic couldn't come either). Could this be what they might have meant? I've never come acorss a situation where I was told there was no ambulance/paramedic available to come to an emergency, does this actually ever happen? In an emergency I would agree that a taxi is not really a suitable alternative!

 

It does seem a strange policy though and one which is causing you, staff and parents anxiety. Would there have been the same level of stress and anxiety had it just been "oh x's temperature is quite high and she doesn't feel very well, let's call mum"? If you didn't have this policy do you really think either child was displaying severe enough symptoms that you would have ever considered phoning an ambulance for them? Of course it's always better to be safe than sorry, but this does sound to me rather like a blanket policy which isn't allowing staff to use good judgement and is instead sending everyone into a panic.