Guest Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 Hi So this is what happened... I got told that this morning a staff member didnt turn up for work (no notice...will deal with that later!). Anyway this meant that club was over ratio as manager called bank staff etc but noone could come in for the hour. Should she have stopped accepting children when she reached 16 (2 staff) and suffered the wrath of parents who were over this number? Children arrive at all different times at breakfast club. As it was she accepted all children due in but the 2 staff kept all children in one room My supervisor at work says she should would have turned parents away due to insurance, OFSTED etc, others have said as a parent you would be fuming to be told you could not drop off especially as it had been paid for. As there was no notice it was difficult to sort out. Manager tried to get someone from school to come in but there was noone as they were all at meeting. What would you do?
AnonyMouse_9838 Posted January 13, 2012 Posted January 13, 2012 Just a thought...are any of the children attending over 8years old? and therefore do not need to be included in ratio?
AnonyMouse_3735 Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 To be quite honest i would have done the same... it was breakfast club and not for hours at a time, so not like it was for a 3 hour session, on a school site so in emergency could have interrupted whatever meeting was happening and got help, not like an offsite preschool, and they were all safer there than by parents leaving them outside unsupervised which is what could have happened if she had stopped taking them into the group. I would think about what was safer for the children and do what I felt was needed and take any consequences should someone question my decision explaining why..
Guest Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 I agree with Inge we have added to our risk assesment in an emergency should staff not turn in for breakfast club as soon as possible try to get cover but inform school so that if something should arise you have back up. sue
Guest Posted January 14, 2012 Posted January 14, 2012 Hi Thanks for the advice. We do have some children that are over the 8years but with 2 staff and over 8 that are under 8 yrs old then this would still make those under 8yrs not in a 1:8 ratio for the 2nd staff member. I have put an action plan in place with the steps to follow. I have since found out that the school cook was able to come in. it was just unfortunate that noone from school could come in for that short period of time. Once school take on the after school club i think the staff would be more inclined to help out. Plus there will be an executive manager who will never be included in ratio so could be called on. So the reason why staff didnt turn up...he left his mobile phone in the car which is his alarm and so he didnt get up in time! He did not phone to apologise but texted this message later to the manager who left a message on his phone....verbal warning I feel coming. Thing is his last verbal, 8 months ago was for not turning up on a shift withoout notice too. But as it has been over the 6 months I take it I have to do another verbal and ot written?? All good fun this!
Guest Posted January 16, 2012 Posted January 16, 2012 I'm sure I've heard before that as long as you have 2 members of staff overall and you are expecting to be able to get hold of someone then you are fine to be out of ratio for a short period in these circumstances. Ofsted accept that these things happen and that as long as you are taking step (trying to call in supply etc) then you are fine to go ahead.
Guest Posted January 16, 2012 Posted January 16, 2012 If you look at ACAS procedures for disciplinary and grievance, I think you will see there is no such thing as a 'verbal warning', it goes directly to first written warning! You will of course need to make sure your procedures are in line with current guidance. Also, I think you may be best placed to inform Ofsted of what happened, how you coped and your plans for the future. Kariana is right I believe, Ofsted accept these things happen, its about how you prepare for it the future. HTH
Guest Posted April 24, 2013 Posted April 24, 2013 Remember the ratios are there for normal practices. If children were safe, which they were, and if the was 'no alternative', then for a brief period I am sure Ofsted wouldn't mind. If you've done everything in your power to try and get staff.
AnonyMouse_25331 Posted April 27, 2013 Posted April 27, 2013 I'm sure I've heard before that as long as you have 2 members of staff overall and you are expecting to be able to get hold of someone then you are fine to be out of ratio for a short period in these circumstances. Ofsted accept that these things happen and that as long as you are taking step (trying to call in supply etc) then you are fine to go ahead. I think this is right - but the main fact would be that the children are not put at any additional risk - and that it could not have been avoided. So if you know that a member is staff isn't able to come in tomorrow, then you have time to sort out children/adults and so no excuse......
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