AnonyMouse_3139 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Elizabeth Truss speaks at the Policy Exchange on childcare "It is telling that I am often asked whether I would be able to look after a certain number of children. I think this line of thinking betrays an attitude that “anyone can do the job”. I don’t start from the premise that anyone can be an early educator. It is an extremely demanding job that requires great and specific expertise.I am not trained to do the job. I am equally sure I would not be able to walk into a class of 30 fourteen-year-olds and teach them German.My ministerial colleagues at the Department of Health don’t get asked if they would be willing to perform keyhole surgery. Those at the MoD aren’t asked if they would fancy hopping on a helicopter and going into battle. Although I suspect that Andrew Robathan and Mark Francois would be up for that. Working in early education isn’t for everyone. Those who do it well are special - and they deserve our thanks. It is a professional career. This made me angry. Of course ministers wouldnt be able to do keyhole surgery, debatable if they could hop onto a helicopter and go into battle, if your family and country were threatened many people, ministers included, possibly would. To say asking her to work with young children means we think 'anyone can do the job' is a very immature comment. We're not asking her have the skills to educate were asking how she would manage all the basic needs given she, like everyone else has just two arms, two eyes, and one lap!! Oh that woman!! http://www.education.gov.uk/inthenews/speeches/a00220991/trusschildcareratios Edited January 30, 2013 by Rea 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_8466 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Actually reading that bit of her speech did make me think about it in a different way. She was saying that she is unqualified to do the job, and that people who do the job we do are special and deserve to have their qualifications, expertise and knowledge valued and recognised. How do the examples she gives in her speech differ to her own position with regard to early years education? Unless Ministers have real life experience in the world their Departments are interested, they are always open to the 'let's see you do the job then' criticism. I wouldn't expect her to go in and run a baby room because she hasn't the qualification, so asking her how she'd manage isn't the best argument we can muster against the changes to ratios, and I fear it distracts us from the real issues. Whilst I don't have an issue with knowing that she couldn't do the job herself, I do have an issue with the people she has been speaking to, and the depth and breadth of the conversations she's had with them. I wonder how much time she has actually spent in settings just watching what goes on and the tasks associated with the job we do with very young children. I can't believe she's had any kind of deep and meaningful dialogue with setting leaders and practitioners. If she had then she would be aware of the furore her changes would cause (even given her reliance on the evidence from other countries) and in which case I think she might have marshalled her arguments more successfully in order to persuade us and reassure us that all will be well. I wouldn't be in her shoes for all the gig tickets in the world - her Department doesn't have enough money to fund early education properly, let alone provide the investment and infrastructure to deliver the improvements in quality whilst reducing the cost of childcare for parents. I'm afraid that unless politicians go back and start at the beginning with wholesale reform (and really think about what early education is all about and what our children need) we will continue to go round this vicious cycle of tinkering around the edges, whilst slowly eroding morale as we strive to achieve the status and recognition we deserve. Liz Truss has made some very encouraging noises about other issues, but let's hope against hope that the workforce (and the industry) holds out against the change in ratios and makes her see the error of her ways. We have the power to turn this policy change on its head - but we'll all need to act together and take a stand against the idea that we need fewer practitioners working with children equitably, meaningfully and safely. As practitioners we are always saying we don't do the job for money - now is the time for owners and managing committees to stand behind us and demonstrate that increasing profits is not more important than meeting the needs of the children and families we support. Ms Truss isn't the first politician to believe that the market (and an improved business model) can solve all the problems of the world and I dare say she won't be the last Minister to come along and give us the benefit of her ideas and philosophies, based on a narrow interpretation of anecdotal evidence and research data. However, let's not dismiss everything she says - we need to embrace the positive aspects (and celebrate what we're good at) but challenge and fight those we disagree with, and which we fear will adversely impact on children's learning. I realise I'm preaching to the converted here, and I didn't intend this to become a rant. Clearly I could never be a Government Minister (let alone a politician). I'm far too emotionally involved to ever be able to make the kinds of decisions Liz Truss has to make - however I do like to think I would choose my advisers well and listen to their counsel. I feel so much better now - thank you for that therapy session! 7 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_705 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 Whilst I fear that some larger chains do seem to support the proposals I too hope that most providers will not change their adult/child ratios, that these proposals will not have any affect. We have to stand firm and kick these proposals into touch. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 (edited) Whilst I fear that some larger chains do seem to support the proposals I too hope that most providers will not change their adult/child ratios, that these proposals will not have any affect. We have to stand firm and kick these proposals into touch. - Chain nurseries - well there's a surprise! Edited January 30, 2013 by Alabaloo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1027 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 - Chain nurseries - well there's a surprise! No they will be rubbing thier hands together 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 You're a nicer person than I am Maz, I also liked some aspects of the report, on first reading it my initial feeling was that common sense was coming back a tad the overall feeling was 'this is ok', shame she had to try to mess with the ratios. I particularly like the removal of LAs regulatory powers at least with Ofsted you know what they'll be asking for, unlike the LA who seem to throw in random things whenever it suits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_5904 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I work for an Early Years team within a local authority. For the second time in two years this government have made announcements that have heralded the end of my post!! Both times I can see what a real tragedy it will be for those I support (the removal of a safety net). The first role that was axed (following Sarah Tether's pronouncementd in Nov 2010) was that of Children Centre teacher. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 It must be hard for you not knowing how safe your job is. To be honest I'd like to go back to the good old days of development workers from thew PLA and social services, our LA continually ask for stuff, its very tiring. Hope you job is one of the safe ones 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1027 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 totally agree bettsdavies :mellow: i find it very sad when practitioners tar those of us that work for LAs (i understand not all are supportive and produce extra paperwork - but we are not all like that - most of our pratitioners would be gutted if we were to go,(and have said so) and we as on the ground bods have to implement what we told by those above!) but yet again we are in turmoil this week by what has been said by Truss........ but hey ho for about the 3rd year in a row we have to suck it and see what happens - :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 My concern over the recommendations about LAs and ofsted roles is that the helpful and supportive early years advisors will lose their jobs, leaving settings adrift. I've had plenty of first hand experience of seeing settings turn it on for ofsted, get a great inspection outcome and then proceed to work in a completely different way. These are the same settings who have told me they don't need to work in partnership with my setting because they got an outstanding/talk to SALT themselves/don't have many children shared across our settings/ etc! Some of the advisors I've had the pleasure to deal with have had a lovely manner and managed to slowly turn these settings round, support others and genuinely enter into a dialogue of developing quality practice. I'm afraid ofsted inspectors won't have the time to do this, even if they have the inclination. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_12960 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I work for an Early Years team within a local authority. For the second time in two years this government have made announcements that have heralded the end of my post!! Both times I can see what a real tragedy it will be for those I support (the removal of a safety net). The first role that was axed (following Sarah Tether's pronouncementd in Nov 2010) was that of Children Centre teacher. well it seems that Ms Truss has upset a great many of us, whther PVI's or LEA advisors. Bettsdavies, the report calls for a cut to LEA's for removing duplication, but how much of the EY budget does this represent. What will LEA's be left with? And will this mean that the LEA will still finance advisory services, or are they all to go? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_19762 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I work for an Early Years team within a local authority. For the second time in two years this government have made announcements that have heralded the end of my post!! Both times I can see what a real tragedy it will be for those I support (the removal of a safety net). The first role that was axed (following Sarah Tether's pronouncementd in Nov 2010) was that of Children Centre teacher. I feel for you and others in your position........for the record my SIP is an absolute star and I would really miss her support - not so much the visits but the knowledge that she is just a 'phone call or email away if and when I need her....... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1027 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 all that will happen is settings will have to pay for advice whether from Ofsted, LAs or private agencies and what PVIs can afford to do that!!!!!!! B) 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_19762 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 all that will happen is settings will have to pay for advice whether from Ofsted, LAs or private agencies and what PVIs can afford to do that!!!!!!! B) I certainly can't Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_705 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 I think as better qualified and informed practitioners we need to make sure the child's voice is heard in all these discussions, amongst the employability agenda from the government and some parts of society putting more value on what children will become in the future rather than who they are now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest sn0wdr0p Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 My EYA is coming to visit me on Friday and I really value the support and advice she gives me. As the owner and manager I appreciate having someone to talk to. I think Friday will give me the chance to take advice about whether to do the new Early Year Teacher qualification. Going back a few posts despite the new ratios I will continue to keep to my current high ratios and would not dream of compromising the quality of care we offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_7677 Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 all that will happen is settings will have to pay for advice whether from Ofsted, LAs or private agencies and what PVIs can afford to do that!!!!!!! B) You echo my views totally!...I fear that we will loose the support from early years advisers from the LA and also the Inclusion funding which we are able to apply for to support children with SEN in our area :blink: 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 30, 2013 Share Posted January 30, 2013 In the Times today it says that according to Elizabeth Truss "Formal structured education needs to start at the age of three." I thought the revised EYFS states that there should be more child-directed activities! Are we meant to return to the days of sitting the children down to do worksheets!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 A teacher on Sky news this morning quoted Michael Gove from 2009, to paraphrase, he said politicians should stay out of education and leave it to the people who understood it. Gone back on that quote hasnt he? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted January 31, 2013 Share Posted January 31, 2013 No they will be rubbing thier hands together hehehe! Pound signs in their eyes! I wonder what the EYPS top up will constitue of..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 I am breathing deeply and trying not to get too stressed. The first and most important thing is that absolutely everyone possible should repsond to the consultation however difficult it appears to be to do so. (Something else to complain about). The second thing to remember is that when politicians propose something totally outrageous, they come back with a 'compromise' which is what they really intended all along, which otherwise we would have rejected out of hand. Lets separate the issue of qualification reform from that of ratio. There was a great deal of investigation and consultation about ratio during the EYFS AND the EYFS review and the overwhelming majority were in favour of keeing the ratios as they are. So after two years the listening has stopped and our views are to be thrown back in our faces. It really is irrelevant what happens in other countries, it is about what is right for our children. If childcare is unaffordable then it should be universally subsidised by government. Unfortunately this government is not just bankrupt of ideas and morals but actually bankrupt. Let us be absolutely clear the ratios we have NOW are the minimum and everything always defaults to the minimum requirement. If these proposals go through let us clearly lay the blame on those politicians responsible not just Truss the mouthpiece, but Gove, Cameron, Clegg and Osborne. Pause for breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_9650 Posted February 1, 2013 Share Posted February 1, 2013 :huh: This might interest you - I have a new little girl started this week. The family is French and Mum was a childminder working in French nurseries. We have put the link to the consultation and petition against the ratio changes on our website and have been asking parents to look at it and make their views known. This new Mum asked for some clarification about what was happening and was horrified. She says that in France it is true that the ratios are 1:4 (Babies) and 1:6 (2 year olds) - however she said in practice in France they operate on ratios of 1:3 (Babies) and 1:4 (Toddlers) and they look to England as an example of best practice as far as ratios are concerned !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3139 Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 :huh: This might interest you - I have a new little girl started this week. The family is French and Mum was a childminder working in French nurseries. We have put the link to the consultation and petition against the ratio changes on our website and have been asking parents to look at it and make their views known. This new Mum asked for some clarification about what was happening and was horrified. She says that in France it is true that the ratios are 1:4 (Babies) and 1:6 (2 year olds) - however she said in practice in France they operate on ratios of 1:3 (Babies) and 1:4 (Toddlers) and they look to England as an example of best practice as far as ratios are concerned !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! That's exactly what I wondered, our government look to other countries, but are we really that bad that no-one would be looking at us? Hope she's filling in the consultation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_9650 Posted February 2, 2013 Share Posted February 2, 2013 That's exactly what I wondered, our government look to other countries, but are we really that bad that no-one would be looking at us? Hope she's filling in the consultation Oh yes! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_21510 Posted February 3, 2013 Share Posted February 3, 2013 I have been uplifted by the passion for early years commitment out there....thank goodness for forums such as this so we can let it out. I have read some really insightful issues since 'the' report and have agreed with many of you My concerns with the ratio changes. I'm the manager of a mixed age setting set in a village hall. I have recently achieved a Degree at the grand old age of 52 and am currently working towards EYPS. The setting is outstanding in Ofsted's terms...(so may in light of recent report dispense with QIA....another issue!). Because of our outstanding status we are/will be recommended to parents eligible for two year old funding. We are already the 'classic' setting where our 2 year old's can and do effect the quality for our 3/4 year old's and I pride myself on our higher than recommended ratio's so this can be addressed. I don't get it...the Govt are fulfilling a promise to parents about funding (for votes I assume) and then cutting it off at the point of delivery. My team are all qualified to level 3 and now having encouraged them to train and have awarded them a higher rate of pay....I have to lay them off?.....because the Govt FEET funding does not cover the current ratio's but would the new ratios ergo we are being manipulated, thanks!!. My parent committee will look at the figures to balance the books rather than listen to my well trained and evaluated ramblings upon theories of how children learn etc.. If we all adhere to the new ratio's and Ofsted are our sole Quality status...how do you think their Annual Report will look? I can make a guess. utterly disgraceful! 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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