Staff not signed up to DBS Update

[AnonyMouse_25678]

One of my 'to do jobs' was to check the 2 members of staff I have with DBS checks on the update service - only to find neither of them registered for the update - stating they knew nothing about it. I know for a fact I asked them both to do it and said I would pay the annual fee, but didn't chase - looking at the system it has to be done within 19 days - seems an odd number but both of them are way beyond this.

 

Do staff have to be on the update service? - Each year they all sign a declaration to say nothing has changed etc - is this sufficient?

 

Appreciate any help - thank you.

[AnonyMouse_19135]

I would imagine it is good practice but none of mine are on the update service - mainly because I got them all re-done before it came in and there was no way I was paying for 10 staff to all be done again!

[AnonyMouse_14268]

I was under the impression that this was a must. All my staff are signed up to the update service. Think it is good practice even if it turns out not to be mandatory. All my committee are as well, which is ridiculous as some of them only serve a year. This was after I had an unpleasant and futile argument with someone over the phone at Ofsted. I actually ended the phone call near to tears with the frustration of it. Would love clarification as to wether committee need to be or not?

[AnonyMouse_23964]

New committee members have to be but this is ofsted requirement. I don't think they have to pay for this. Staff do not have to, yet. If taking on new staff it makes good sense to insist they sign up to the update service. There is no requirement so far that established staff must complete dbs. Lots of people are still on CRB's. You should have a system in place that gives the opportunity for staff to declare any changes - annual declaration, supervisions.

[AnonyMouse_14268]

I know committee need to be DBS but cannot understand the need for them to be signed up to the update service.

[AnonyMouse_64776]

I had two staff members who got their DBS returned after the nineteen days stipulated (it had taken them 3 weeks after issuing it to actually send it out) and when I phoned to ask if they could apply for the annual update outside of the timescale because it was their fault, I was told no. What a stupid system! Luckily staff don't need to do it but it is just more convenient.

[AnonyMouse_7120]

This is the first year I've had anyone to check, do I just put their dbs number in the checker or need something else ? 1 person didn't do it in time, I did check if that was now a problem but wasn't while working for us, just going forward to new employer, though I've known a couple of people get new jobs they are signed up and the new employers had them do the full dibs again anyway :-/

Edited September 6, 2016 by Mouseketeer

[AnonyMouse_14268]

I think you just put the DBS number and D.O.B into the checker.

[AnonyMouse_19920]

i think as long as you get the staff to sign the letter saying that nothing has changed with themselves and their family etc., that is fine as that is what we do - think you could goggle and find a copy.

[AnonyMouse_13453]

Oh right! That's going to be cheaper than starting from scratch again as a few of ours haven't subscribed to the update service.

[AnonyMouse_51737]

To take on someone with update service you input dob and number, see original copy of DBS certificate. I have a form which staff sign to say they know we are performing a check and outcome inline with update guidelines. I've found it useful for casual staff who you may not use over a longer period to check their suitability. We are doing a steady migration over for all staff about half still have CRBs.

[AnonyMouse_7120]

Thanks, also thinking of updating staff still on crbs, I'm registered with capita to complete the ID checks for staff and committee but how or by who would my ID get checked ?

Edited September 7, 2016 by Mouseketeer

[AnonyMouse_23964]

We also plan to gradually change staff over to dbs. Mouseketeer - to complete your application you need to register another person from your staff or committee with Capita and they can then check your ID details.

Edited September 7, 2016 by lsp

[AnonyMouse_19920]

Thanks, also thinking of updating staff still on crbs, I'm registered with capita to complete the ID checks for staff and committee but how or by who would my ID get checked ?

what i did was put someone else on who could check these - our book keeper who was already dbs checked and has worked with us for a long time can now do this too and it means she can check mine - i just provided some details (cant remember what,sorry) to capita and they added her to the list of people who could check forms etc.,

so if you have someone like that that would be the answer - hope thats a help.

[AnonyMouse_7120]

Thank you, will do that then when I get around to it :-)

[Guest]

Mouseketeer

I would check this out - a few years ago I tried to get my (then) CRB redone and asked my manager to carry out the ID checks. Capita queried this with me (as I pay her and could therefore "bribe her") and said it was not acceptable and I only needed to get it updated if Ofsted asked me to and they would organise ID check - that may well have changed now though based on blondie's post.

Ofsted managed to subsequently loose all my personal paperwork and I had to get it redone anyway LOL!

[AnonyMouse_19920]

Mouseketeer

I would check this out - a few years ago I tried to get my (then) CRB redone and asked my manager to carry out the ID checks. Capita queried this with me (as I pay her and could therefore "bribe her") and said it was not acceptable and I only needed to get it updated if Ofsted asked me to and they would organise ID check - that may well have changed now though based on blondie's post.

Ofsted managed to subsequently loose all my personal paperwork and I had to get it redone anyway LOL!

we only did this last year - we are committee run group so i don't pay her but as we have known each other for a very long time and are good friends i could have "bribed" her - i suppose the system is only as honest as the people using it.

[Guest]

we only did this last year - we are committee run group so i don't pay her but as we have known each other for a very long time and are good friends i could have "bribed" her - i suppose the system is only as honest as the people using it.

 

They have changed it then - thank goodness! It is so silly when they can cross check to other government records that you are who you are!

[AnonyMouse_55063]

It is not a must. It is not even a must that staff are DBS checked every year let alone 3 years. It is just best practice and of course doing DBS checks on staff (however it is done) more regular is of course better protection for the children they care for. Other things within your setting will also contribute to the Child Protection that is so important. A good Supervision system is one good example and that the right questions are asked regarding convictions or people associated and convictions. If any suspicion arises then apply for a DBS check to double check the file.

 

A DBS check is only a small way to protect children and even a DBS check only flags up people who have been convicted!! So although useful, it is very limited in how it protects children.

[AnonyMouse_7120]

I know you're right Broadoaks in saying we don't need to update ......and in reality, what is it ? a piece of paper that says someone hasn't been caught :-(

[AnonyMouse_7227]

I had two staff members who got their DBS returned after the nineteen days stipulated (it had taken them 3 weeks after issuing it to actually send it out) and when I phoned to ask if they could apply for the annual update outside of the timescale because it was their fault, I was told no. What a stupid system! Luckily staff don't need to do it but it is just more convenient.

I had no idea about this update service until I had a similar situation. Tbh I think it should be compulsory to be in the update service. I have to go and do another dbs now for setting I work voluntarily for.

[AnonyMouse_33773]

To take on someone with update service you input dob and number, see original copy of DBS certificate. I have a form which staff sign to say they know we are performing a check and outcome inline with update guidelines. I've found it useful for casual staff who you may not use over a longer period to check their suitability. We are doing a steady migration over for all staff about half still have CRBs.

Why is the original copy of the DBS certificate needed? And why a form about you checking if they have given you their number?

[AnonyMouse_51737]

Why is the original copy of the DBS certificate needed? And why a form about you checking if they have given you their number?

I always ask to see it as to check what has been requested as to check that it's child services and not adult also to see if there is a list of disclosed issues as it's not listed on update. I let staff know I'm performing a check and then after the check, I get signatures for both as under the update guidance an individual should know prior to a check being made getting signatures verifies they know.

[AnonyMouse_33773]

I always ask to see it as to check what has been requested as to check that it's child services and not adult also to see if there is a list of disclosed issues as it's not listed on update. I let staff know I'm performing a check and then after the check, I get signatures for both as under the update guidance an individual should know prior to a check being made getting signatures verifies they know.

I had no idea of these three things - thanks for making me aware!

Where did you get the guidance/requirements on this?

What to do if an applicant doesn't have the certificate anymore - they may believe that they don't need it when registered with the update service.

[AnonyMouse_51737]

I had no idea of these three things - thanks for making me aware!

Where did you get the guidance/requirements on this?

What to do if an applicant doesn't have the certificate anymore - they may believe that they don't need it when registered with the update service.

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/dbs-update-service-employer-guide

 

Hope that link works! It's a good guide, particular note should be taken to adult and child workforce as if it's a check only on child workforce you can not use that DBS.

The certificate may contain information not readable on the the update service so the certificate must be seen to check the validity of the information. I would not use the update service / employ anyone without seeing the certificate it would be a new application update service or not. The guide is useful and I printed a copy for in file at work.

 

Just a note you can sign up to the DBS update service on application of DBS I encourage my staff to do this rather than wait for certificate as mr/mrs postman are shocking around here....

Edited September 18, 2016 by Foreveryoung

[AnonyMouse_13453]

Thanks for that. I have a new committee member who works with vulnerable children and so I wanted to know if I could just check her paperwork or ask her to do another DBS. It's a bit confusing, that scenario they give, as to whether she needs a new one or not, but as it's free, I may side with caution and ask her to do one. In the job she has, she should be pleased that we are safeguarding conscious!

[AnonyMouse_7120]

Another dbs question I'm struggling to find the answers for, We will be having a school student in (16 yrs old) once a week who is doing child development, obviously not in ratio or unsupervised with children but should they have a voluntary DBS check carried out ? I'm suprised the school haven't mentioned this :-/