Ofsted tribunal

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Hi

Has anyone ever been to tribunal with ofsted regarding them refusing registration?

 

I have the telephone discussion coming up today to arrange the date for the tribunal hearing and was wondering if anyone can advise what to expect?

 

Thanks

Edited May 10, 2017 by klc106

[FSFRebecca]

I don't have any experience of this - who will be the arbitrator of the tribunal?

[AnonyMouse_35585]

It's an independent judge

[FSFRebecca]

From which organisation? In the registration handbook (p23, para 107) there is reference to 'an independent external body, the Health, Education and Social Care Chamber First-Tier Tribunal'

A quick Google search brings up the following: Health, Education and Social Care Chamber tribunal rules

Presumably they have explained the format of the tribunal and the issues to be discussed?

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Yes that's who the tribunal is with and it has been explained I was just wondering if anyone has personal experience of it as it's a difficult thing to go through

[FSFRebecca]

Yes that's who the tribunal is with and it has been explained I was just wondering if anyone has personal experience of it as it's a difficult thing to go through

Of course, hopefully someone will be able to shed some light on it for you. Good luck!

[AnonyMouse_1469]

Are you amember of the PSLA, or some such organisation??PSLA has a lawcall service that might be able to help you? Or what about the association of small businesses?

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Unfortunately I'm not a member ? Had the phone call and the hearing is set for 18th September and will last 4 days!

 

Ofsted have a solicitor representing them but I just can't afford one ?

Edited May 10, 2017 by klc106

[AnonyMouse_19762]

Unfortunately I'm not a member Had the phone call and the hearing is set for 18th September and will last 4 days!

 

Ofsted have a solicitor representing them but I just can't afford one

Crikey that's tough klc - who can you have with you?

[AnonyMouse_35585]

I can have witnesses to give evidence for me and i can have people sit in for support similar to a court case. Found out ofsted have 7 witnesses but no idea who they all are until I get there evidence on 7th June! It's so stressful ?

[AnonyMouse_19802]

I admire your persistence with this Kic and wish you luck! Not sure given all the 'problems' associated with early years now, that I wouldn't look at a change of career!

Good luck with it anyway!

[AnonyMouse_35585]

I am currently doing care with the elderly to bring in some money but I do miss the children so much! I just can't imagine not working in early years. I 'borrow' my friends little ones as much as I can x

[AnonyMouse_55063]

I just re-read the original thread regarding this awful situation you have been put in. It was almost 12 months ago, and only now a tribunal is taking place?

 

Did you ever get the Ofsted report and their perception of your provision?

 

They have 7 witnesses.. how have they found these? Are they inspectors or other observers of your practice, ie parents, visitors?

 

Of course they will have the best solicitor's that public money can afford :rolleyes: - they have an amazing reputation to uphold! Yes, solicitors are usually very organized and professional but the law, is the law, and they can't change that.

 

If you have broken the law.. ie being threatened with a fine of £5000 - was this the reason for the suspension? This is the only time a "law break" was mentioned, I think? They did give you a time frame to comply and I presume this was resolved?

 

Sorry for all the questions and I just want to understand this situation more clearly. It will be an interesting case from the outside, although very worrying and stressful for you - the outcome of this might help others in a similar situation or future situation. The more facts we know, the better advise can be given. You now have the opportunity to defend yourself legally.. keep it simple and to the point. I wish you the very best of luck.

[AnonyMouse_35585]

I chose to resign from the pre-school and closed it back in June 2016, I couldn't get the staff I needed.

I then decided to become a childminder and put my application in in September 2016. I have worked hard to set my house up, dedicating the downstairs to childminding and organising the paperwork I needed. I had my registration visit in January 2017 and it seems to go perfectly. However, the next day I got a phone call to say they were refusing my registration and if I chose to appeal the decision rather than withdraw my application then I will be disqualified and not able to work with children in any way, or foster or adopt.

I chose to appeal the decision as I have never actually done anything wrong I just found my management skills were not good enough to get my staff to do what was needed which is why I think childminding will be best as I only have myself rather than managing staff.

The appeal meeting took place in march and again it went perfectly, I took a lot of evidence with me to show how I promote children's learning and all my risk assessments etc. I then had to wait 10 days for their decision which turned out to be a no. The reason for this being that although my knowledge and paperwork is perfect they don't feel I can put it in to practice. I have offered them to come and see my practice numerous times but they refused.

The next stage is now the tribunal. I am not sure who the 7 witnesses are and will get the evidence from ofsted on 7th June.

I have spoken to a solicitor and they said it was very likely I will lose the tribunal case as I can't evidence my practice within a court room.

The main thing I want to defend is my right to work with children. I have never harmed a child and would never dream of doing so. All the children I have cared for have gone to school ready for their next chapter and are doing well, including a little girl with autism who I helped get her statemented to get into a special school.

The solicitor wanted £240 per hour and I just cannot afford that sort of money.

 

Apologies for the long post ?

[AnonyMouse_55063]

No need to apologise, thank you for explaining further. It must have been hell these last few years having to deal with all this. The more details you share, the better advise we can give. It is difficult to understand the whole situation and this makes it impossible to understand why Ofsted would make this decision? Like you said, you have not harmed a child and if you applied for a DBS it would be clear! You seem extremely passionate and you have shown good practice in the past with a Good Ofsted grade. The route to go solo seemed like the obvious choice given your admission of bad management skills.

 

Maybe a different route would have been to employ a manager, who would also be the registered person and you would be the owner of the business, although I am unsure if you would then be allowed to work with the children. That would be crazy if you couldn't?

 

It is a very strange scenario to hear about and it is interesting because this could happen to anybody and it just doesn't seem right to me! I can only guess that Ofsted do not believe the children would be safe within your care but I am unsure as to exactly why they are forming this judgement. The only evidence I have read is that they came in to Judge your setting and they deemed it unsafe? Surely they must now need to give you another chance to show them?

 

PS - Your LA Improvement Team want sacking - they seem unfit for purpose, from what I have read!

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Thank you. Nobody who knows me or has worked with me can understand how this is all happening and they know that childcare is my passion. That's the reason I got my degree and eyps!

I have contended the LA to see if they would come and see my practice with friends children and they said they cannot get involved now that ofsted are involved!!

[AnonyMouse_37203]

I`m afraid I don`t have any useful advice to pass on, but I feel compelled to comment. I am so sorry that you are facing this. Could you join PSLA or NDNA retrospectively? Would be cheaper than the lawyer. Sending virtual hugs and positive vibes your way.

[AnonyMouse_22029]

Klc Im horrified to hear about your situation.

Stay strong and keep posting we will do all we can.

Xx

[AnonyMouse_37203]

Someone on another thread has said the Federation of Small Businesses offer free legal advice £142. Don't know what their experience of OFSTED might be though. NDNA / PSLA probably more relevant.

[AnonyMouse_55063]

MarshaD - I prefer the free legal advise £0 - joke. I am sure the Federation of Small Businesses is great to join.

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Ok a further update just to add to my stress... got an email on bank holiday Monday from my landlord to say he is not happy for me to be a childminder at his property and that he never agreed to it when I moved in despite estate agents telling me he had.

 

So now the dilemma of-

1. do I try and find a new house and get it ready before the tribunal

Or

2. Do I stay at this house and wait for the outcome of the tribunal before looking for a new house if they let me register

 

18 months of stress relating to work I wish it would just end now!!

[AnonyMouse_22029]

Sorry I don't think I have any words of comfort for you. Don't despair. You will make the right decision.

Thinking of you.

[AnonyMouse_16163]

Oh my goodness will your nightmare never end. I think you have enough on your plate at the moment and so I would take option 2 for the time being and wait for the outcome of the tribunal. God forbid they rule against you, but if they do there would be no point in looking for another house. I cannot imagine the stress you are going through as this seems all very personal and unfair. Try to stay strong and get help from wherever and from whoever you can.

 

Good luck with it all. x

[AnonyMouse_23964]

Valid point Manor. Good luck klc106 and I hope you get some good news soon.

[AnonyMouse_14268]

Just catching up on this thread again and I am stunned that this is happening to you. I have no advice to give, but just wanted to say I am thinking of you and hope it turns out OK.

[AnonyMouse_29641]

Sending support. Sorry no advice except to say that you are an EYP! You seriously deserve to be earning more than a childminder. Defend your reputation. All strength to you.

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Thank you all for your support! Means a lot x

[AnonyMouse_16163]

Hi klc106,

 

Just wondering how you are and how the tribunal went, or are you to traumatised by it all to be able to give an update? Wouldn't blame you if this is the case, I sure would be. Just hoping it went in your favour?

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Hi

Apologies for the delayed update.

I have the date of the tribunal set for 7th-11th August.

I have received the evidence from ofsted and to be honest a lot of it is incorrect or misleading. I have also sent my evidence to them and should receive the whole evidence bundle by the weekend in preparation for the tribunal.

In my evidence I have decided to go down the route of showing them how I've reflected on things that have happened, training I've done since I closed the preschool and what I've been doing with my niece over the past year. I have done her a learning journey and have been doing weekly planning etc the same as I would do when childminding as an example (I did this to show at my registration visit but he never looked).

It's now a case of waiting for the tribunal but I can never stop thinking about the fact that I may never do the job I love again!

 

Thanks again for all your support and I promise to keep you updated!

[AnonyMouse_35585]

Ok the nerves are really setting in now as I sit and go through questions to ask during cross examination of the 7 witnesses they have!!

The tribunal starts on the 8th August so just over a week to go. Eeeek ?