Helen Posted June 23, 2007 Author Share Posted June 23, 2007 Thanks for the comments I've completed the same sort of thing for the six areas of learning, and have been in touch with Ruth Pimentel about the recording keeping stuff. She's been very helpful, and I'm going to put together a short article with attachments over the next couple of days (or sooner if Steve's nagging works!) Many practitioners are having the same concerns, I think, and if everyone pulls together and pools their ideas, we're onto a winner I think it's especially important to get LA advisors helping each other; nobody wants each LA to reinvent the wheel! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 Thank you Helen, that will be really useful. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_4495 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 I keep hearing we are not to use checklists in the new EYFS. How can we possibly track chidren's development without them? From what limited amount of time I have spent looking at the documents so far and reading the forum, there could be a case of mixed use of words... I think that a checklist against the development matters is acceptable so that you can see if children are progressing developmentally (even though it is clearly stated that children do not necessarily conform to research - there's a surprise ) and can be used for early identification of any problems. I think that a ticklist where you actually tick that a child has achieved something is where the issues arise. The language has been very carefully written in the charts to state that a child is 'developing an understanding', 'attempts to', 'is learning to', 'shows an interest in' etc. Personally speaking, I can't see how you can put an actual date to this as it is ongoing progression. You could match it up to a dated observation to show that the child has achieved something on that particular date, but to use the 'tick and move on' approach that I've come across in settings (not suggesting for a moment that anyone does this on here) is certainly not the ethos of the EYFS. Please don't read this as a criticism on what Helen has created as I think that they are very valuable documents, but I can see how some poorer quality providers would use these or this form of ticklist in isolation as the only form of evidence, rather than as part of a picture (obs, photos, home/nursery diaries etc) as an 'outcome', which is what we are not striving for. I hope that this reads as I've meant it to and that I haven't offended anyone in the process. RB x PS - Helen, I think it's great that you are in conversation with Ruth Pimintel - she was at the NDNA conference on Thursday and passionately believes that they have (almost!) got this one right. Looking forward to hearing more.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted June 23, 2007 Share Posted June 23, 2007 (edited) I was reading the previous comments in this post and I also have the same question: Do we have to make a weekly individual plan for each child ? I am alone with 16 children. That means I have to do everything all by myself: planning, follow up and continuos assessment... also the displays and cleaning the classroom. I make a weekly general plan with some adult initiated activities (4 - 5 max./day) and I try to provide some new resources for the topic, but the rest is child initiated. If I would have to provide 9 different continuos provision activities per day, isn't that going against their individual interests? It seems like expecting them to go to all of those stations, even if they don't want to. Imagine me running around the 9 stations to see that all of the 16 children get to do all of these activities ! I present a topic, based on the interest of the children (some common throughout the years, others seen in the present group) and it is just a stimulous for them to expand it. I love to see them show their developing understanding, their reasoning, their creativity, the way they laugh and enjoy the topics, and their mutual ongoing relationships. Edited June 23, 2007 by SmileyPR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_7150 Posted June 24, 2007 Share Posted June 24, 2007 Thank you Helen, looking forward to it with baited breath. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 I was reading the previous comments in this post and I also have the same question: Do we have to make a weekly individual plan for each child ? Hi Smiley PR I was at an EYFS launch this morning and they seemed to be saying exactly that! You observe each child, seeing them as a 'unique child' and plan for that child, observe again, plan again etc She said 'gone are the days when you can do your year's planning in the summer holidays' - you can have 'overarching' themes to follow, but the planning can only be done when you know what interests the individual child The other thing that shocked me a bit was how she showed us the poster and how 'learning and devleopment' is 1/16th of what we are supposed to be delivering and cannot be done in isolation ie without the other 15/16 - and she said each is equally important Sarahx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wolfie Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 GULP!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2732 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Sorry, that is not possible. Look at each child, build upon their interests, yes, but every day/week?? I don't really think that's quite what they mean -?? Sue Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_4544 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Have you seen the planning format on the EYFS? http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...dresourcing.pdf http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...3-4yearolds.pdf http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...3-4yearolds.pdf http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...g-2yearolds.pdf http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...ngfrombirth.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_4495 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 The other thing that shocked me a bit was how she showed us the poster and how 'learning and devleopment' is 1/16th of what we are supposed to be delivering and cannot be done in isolation ie without the other 15/16 - and she said each is equally important Sarahx That's exactly the phrase that Ruth Pimintel used at the NDNA conference. I think that they are trying to get over the 'holistic' nature of the EYFS as opposed to teaching/learning just about maths, language, creativity etc. Not sure though! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Come on! But we do ask their interests, we observe them and keep rechanging the plans if necessary, ... but one plan per child per day? That is completely unrealistic, especially if one is alone . I can't be prouder of my class. They were a wonderful class and they were always happy. They finished learning through play and they are very enthousiastic about starting Grade 1. Parents were always happy because their children were always happy. Isn't that what this is all about? All this is contradictory. They want this (of the EYFS).. very child centered, but then they want higher academic standards (phonics, reading, writing). I just can't understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted June 25, 2007 Share Posted June 25, 2007 Marion, Is there anything about the planning for 4-5 year olds (Reception)? Thanks! You are always there to help us. You are an angel ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Posted June 26, 2007 Author Share Posted June 26, 2007 I agree with everything you've said Running Bunny, and you haven't offended anyone I've uploaded the completed child records for the EYFS into the resource library, in the observation and assessment section. Please use as you wish (but not as a mere ticklist!). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thank you for sharing those Helen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Thank you Helen - those will save hours of work! Sarahx Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Just trying to do a bit of mental maths - We have 50 children all attending part time and 6 staff all attending part time - so one plan per child = 50 x ?????what??? each area of learning per week? We are open 38 weeks per year so that makes 1x50=50x6= 300x 38= 11,400 individual plans per academic year!?!?!?! so if the children stay for 2 years TOTAL INDIVIDUAL PLANS = 22,800 Wow! Can't see the benefit for the planet regarding paper usage - and I'm not really an eco warrier - but that does strike me as a little unreasonable somehow . . has somebody really thought this through????????????????????????????????????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_705 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Surely they don't mean one plan per child per day? Rather having observed an interest in a child, we plan to meet that need and adapt/fine tune/extend by scribbling on your planning, adding resources etc on an ongoing basis. Planning one activity for a child on one day is not going to ensure that they will achieve what we hope they will achieve. Or am I naive? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 My mental maths post above is worked out on one plan per child per week - if it was per day well............no - somone's pulling our leg, surely???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1208 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 I agree Deb, if we planned from the children's interest ony many would achieve little! They have such limited experiences. This may work in a middle class area where chn. go to different places and do things at home with their parents - then again these are the children that will need stretching further! Unless we introduce children to dinosaurs, traditional tales, planting etc. etc. they would never experience these things, they need something to build upon. Aren't we there to extend their experiences? Won't this cause more of a divide between boys and girls? I totally agree with being sponateous and doing some work on snails if someone finds one in the garden, but how can you do this with individuals? Wouldn't you need 1 member of staff for each child I know I haven't read the details of how this is going to work so I may have the wrong end of the stick, but every time I delve further I become more and more worried about the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_3735 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 it just amazes me that someone somewhere thinks that by writing down what we believe the children need to achieve in such detail actually helps the child in any way. Where are we to find the time to actually implement this mountain of paper and interact with the children, particularly with the ratios they are advocating.. is the ideas that so long as its documented it happens .... mmm me thinks not somehow. thought we were supposed to be doing less paperwork not 100 times more. Inge Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_4544 Posted June 26, 2007 Share Posted June 26, 2007 Marion, Is there anything about the planning for 4-5 year olds (Reception)? Thanks! You are always there to help us. You are an angel ! The first link is for reception children http://www.standards.dfes.gov.uk/eyfs/reso...dresourcing.pdf Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Can't sleep for thinking about all the paper work involved. I am in total agreement with you Inge. The balance between that which is documented, and that which is actively undertaken has to be in balance. I think that alot of what is suggested in EYFS (and I haven't recieved my hardcopy yet) is spot on....in an ideal, well funded and resourced world. I am eagerly awaiting training that will enlighten me to how it will all work, in the meantime I am ever grateful to you for your ideas and links to websites and resources, which can sometimes scare me! On observation and assessment...I was quoted an interesting farm analogy to set me thinking: You can measure a pig all you want, but it won't get fatter unless you feed it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted June 27, 2007 Share Posted June 27, 2007 Thanks, Marion , for the link and also thanks, Helen, for the documents you shared. Sorry, I forgot to thank you for it . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted June 28, 2007 Share Posted June 28, 2007 Hi All Long Time Since logged in, but all this is making interesting reading! We were hoping to use a similar format to what we use now to evidence children's learning. That is a format similiar to Hali's play plan (page 1) exept a second column containing date and a third containing an observation showing the child carrying out that 'stepping stone' as things stand now. We also have narratives and photo's through out the file evidencing this also. Hope that makes sense . I'm all a bit confused about this and we keep getting told not to worry about it just yet, training will happen in due course! Does all this mean we can't evidence like this? We've not even entered planning stage yet! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_8374 Posted June 29, 2007 Share Posted June 29, 2007 Hi al,I am new to this forum but would like to say that our preschool have been doing the eyfs profiles as the pilot scheme for the past year. We have undertaken training and have been working to it up to the present day. We had lots of teething problems in the beginning but have just got things rolling along and guess what? its all changing again for 2008 we have received our hard back copies of the new eyfs but not fully read it yet. as for observations, how we have worked it is: we choose six children per week to do focused observations on and add them to the weekly plan. When that child is doing an activity with a member of staff, the member of staff will write down any observations onto a sticky address label which is passed on to the childs keyworker at the end of the week and all sticky labels are then attached to evidence sheets under each heading of the profile areas of learning. We carry sticky labels in our pockets and are constantly writing quick notes of the children that we are doing activities with. Hope this makes sense to you and that it might be of some use to you. This is thequickest and easiest method we have found up to now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_1195 Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 Off topic -Just a quick welcome to you Anita and thanks for sharing with us all. That is what you will find so good about this forum, everyone is willing to share ideas etc. It really is a help to us all, as our members are very suportive of each other. Keep posting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Helen Posted June 30, 2007 Author Share Posted June 30, 2007 Welcome, Anita, and thanks for making your first post When you say EYFS profiles, I'm guessing you don't mean the ones to be filled in at the end of reception, but some kind on formative assessment process based on the new EYFS? I'd love to hear more about your piloting experiences! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Wolfie Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 A big welcome from me too Anita! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AnonyMouse_2776 Posted June 30, 2007 Share Posted June 30, 2007 Welcome, Anita, and thanks for sharing your experience ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted May 20, 2008 Share Posted May 20, 2008 Thanks everyone, I am new to the forum and currently doing a foundation degree, this module is on the EYFS! Which we have only just begun to implement and have had no training. I have the pack, it sounds really good in theory, but the planning both short, medium and long term have me pannicking. Have I lost the plot? How can you do long term and medium term planning when you are following the child's interest and have a high turnover of children, very little budget and few permanent staff who are not even given time out to plan. Is there a quick method, I know nothing about that works and is easy to document! Anyway in my midst of pannick you have all made me smile with your advice and concerns Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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