Naughty Chair/naughty

[AnonyMouse_7317]

Hi

I have had a discussion with somone today where we discussed how I do not use the word Naughty in my setting or the Naughty chair which we replace with not nice/ or not sensible. I know i have been told that we should not use the N word or have a naughty chair but have time out or reflection time. I was asked if this is in writing any where or in any guidance. I know i was told this at college but can not think I have seen it in print any where. Do not know if this was just a personal belief from my management at the time or not. Can anyone help??

[AnonyMouse_4495]

I don't think that you'll find it in any guidance as the 'sanctions' should be appropriate to each age and stage of development of each child.

We were 'banned' from using the word naughty and it was reinforced to us that it was the behaviour of the child that was naughty and not the child themself. For example, 'biting is naughty' not 'Charlie is naughty'.

 

Naughty chairs/spots etc are the rage at the moment due to influence of supernanny type programmes. I'm not in favour of them as it isolates the individual child and puts them 'on display' to the other children. Whether the 'good' children then fear the humiliation and behave is a matter to be discussed.

 

It's a fine balance to not reward bad behaviour by giving the 'offender' attention, but I can't see that sitting them on a chair in full view of everyone in the nursery - staff including - is going to solve the problem in the long run?

 

Thought that you might like this though...

THE NEW AND IMPROVED NAUGHTY STEP

 

 

Ooohh, why is it so big? Any help to make it smaller would be appreciated!!

Edited April 11, 2007 by Running Bunny

[Guest]

We use the term 'time out' mat for a little one with special educational needs. We have a behaviour system in place (J.Mosely/ sun & cloud.. move to the cloud and loss of golden time). Our SEN child doesn't understand this (has severe language delay) and although it does sound 'humiliating' he is totally oblivious to the separate repemind he recieves for unwanted behaviour (which is challenging at times).

If anyone has any other ideas - quite open to recieve them.

The rest of the class are quite clear when they have showed underiserable behaviour. I personally discuss with children what they think they have done wrong and then encourage them to 'put the wrong' right.

I try my best to focus and reinforce the good behaviour (occassionally checking the repremands I make angainst the amount of praise I hand out!)

I/ and my training considered it not really good practice to use the word 'naughty'. I haven't seen this in print anywhere but I guess it derives from the fact that stating unwanted behaviour and getting children to develop a sense of responsibility for their actions seems clearer to them - it is the behaviour that is unwanted. Using the word naughty can sometimes be confused with the child themselves and promotes a low self-esteem.

Don't know if that made sense & just my own personal point of view. But I don't like the word 'naughty' being used in class (and still need to try to get my collegue to stop using it!)

Edited April 11, 2007 by Guest

[AnonyMouse_1027]

love it running bunny

[AnonyMouse_1195]

I agree with you Skylight as I really don't like to hear children being described as naughty. Actions may be naughty but children aren't. I did have a 'quiet' chair by my book area where a child would sit for some time out if needed, but only for a short time and then we talked about what had happened and how to behave or deal with whatever it was that led to them being put there is the first place. Sometimes children need time out to understand that they have behaved in an unacceptable way or to have a chance to calm down. Sometimes they need to be there to protect other children from their behaviour but then I think it is important to try to pre-empt poor behaviour re-occuring. A long job I know and with some really disturbed children a very very long job.

I have had Ed. Psychologists suggest a 'naughty' chair but I have never been able to bring myself to call it that.

[Guest]

I saw a really good idea when I visited a nursery recently. They had been to Staples or somewhere similar and bought one of those display mounts with smiley faces as a border. They had taken individual photos of each child, laminated them and they were blu tacked onto the smiley board. If a child made one of the staff 'sad' for any reason their picture had to be removed from the smiley to beside it but if they were then good for x period of time then their picture could go back on the smiley board. Every child started the day on the smiley board which is great and I can imagine this could be very effective - at least for a while! I've bought the board (£1.90 ish) and next I must photograph the children (might use the technique in the photo above Running Bunny!! - love the pic!!!)

[Guest tinkerbell]

Wow love your n......y chair Running Bunny

Tinkerbellx

[AnonyMouse_4544]

Wonder if the erm chair comes in age5+

[AnonyMouse_75]

the question about is there anything in writing about using the word "naughty"

there may be something written about "labelling theory"

[Guest]

I forgot to mention ... Running Bunny I do like your photo (just feel a bit sad for the duck!)

Skylight

[Guest]

I have used a similar system to ljw but the faces were drawn by the children themselves ( hence they felt more 'responsible' for their face, therefore their actions) the faces are put on a traffic light sign ie green is the equivilent to 'smiles'.If a child behaves innapropriately they move to amber, where they have an opportunity to reconcile to move back to green or if behaviour deteriates they go to red. (the children physically moving the face themselves again reinforces ownership of their actions) I would not enforce moving the child to amber etc as a first port of call for negitive behaviour but acts as a sanction for repeated negitive behaviour.

Having written this I can see how it may sound a bit harsh, but works well with my reception class and visually represents the effect of the childs behaviour. This visual system also work well as discussion points during cirlce time or other realted PSED discussions.

 

I hope this makes sense; do ask if not!

 

Lisa

 

* negative NOT negitive ooooppss!

[AnonyMouse_7317]

Thank you for the suggestion Alison found an article all about naughty being banned if anyone is interested please click the link naughty banned

[AnonyMouse_6021]

I read that article with interest, I'm conscientiously try not to use the 'N' word at work, saying instead things like 'that makes us/her/him sad' etc; but at home, while I don't say 'you're naughty', I do tell my boy 'that's naughty because.....'. He's got the face of an angel and I don't want him to think that a smile or a kiss will make everything better or even worse, say an insincere 'sorry' so he can carry on doing whatever.

Karrie

[Guest]

We use a happy and sad face. I have the children's names on cards and put them on the sad face or happy face. It works well as it is visual, if they have 3 sad faces we have to write their name in the beahviour book which their parents see, we also write nice things in the beahviour book. We also have a sad face chair where you sit to have a think and a chance to do the right thing. Although I have 7 children on the SEN register for behaviour I don't need to use the chair very often and tend to use it for a child to calm down. The January intake have took to this system well and all I have to say is I am gonna put you on the sad face and they self correct.

[Guest]

I have been reading this with interest as my early years advisor has just told me i need to devise some kind of behaviour chart. We are a pre-school - children aged 2-4, she says we need to devise some sort of system which would include certifcates going home to parents. We do discuss behaviour at circle time, have mr men cards i.e mr bump says we walk in pre-school etc. we have a kind hands tree etc. give out stickers etc but now i need to come up with something extra. It has to be easy as we have 24 children per session. Oh well, something else to think about, did like the idea of the faces and using the display board might give this some more thought.

 

I also had a visit from an EP who said it was fine to have a naughty chair and we should put one in the pre-school for particular child, she also said we should say no thats naughty, i was always told not to say this but instead thats not nice, look ???? is crying you've made them sad etc....

Edited April 12, 2007 by Guest

[Guest Wolfie]

There are some really nice stickers related to behaviour on the Pedagogues website that give messages to parents about good behaviour really easily for you!

[AnonyMouse_64]

I think that the idea that we shouldn't label children by telling them that they are naughty is a good one. Children need to know that they are intrinsically good and that they have a choice as to how they behave. Some behaviour is acceptable and some is not - again they have to learn which is which. However, what is wrong with actually using the word naughty? It is a perfectly good word and describes exactly what we want to convey and the children understand it too! I am worried that many people are starting to use the word 'bad' instead of naughty, which for me conjures up worse images. Bad/good is too black and white and leaves nothing in between - a void where mischievousness would live but is being denied a place. There is always the danger that these sorts of things go too far and what we end up with is something worse than we started with.

 

Also, while I am on a roll , naughty chair/time out/place for reflection - whatever it is called it is still the same and calling it different names is not changing it! Don't fool yourselves into thinking that because you have asked little Peter to sit for a while to reflect on his actions, that the rest of the children aren't all saying "Look, Peters been naughty!"

[AnonyMouse_6021]

We have had parents tell that they use a naughty chair at home and they would like us to use one to ensure continuity, which we have done, but we've never called it a naughty chair. We've only ever used it if a child has been aggressive or violent and told them they need time to calm down. Some children are called naughty when they really just bored or want adult attention and know that being 'naughty' gets it!

Karrie

[Guest]

We try not to use naughty as a word, usually we say that makes me sad when you... or you have hurt... etc. We have a yellow smiley face where we write childrens names if they have been extra helpful or kind and a red sad face where their names go when they have been 'naughty'. The children are clear about what they have to do to get on either board and are given a 'warning' like a second chance before they go on the sad face. As a whole school there is a policy for behaviour which involves a warning and then if the behaviour continues they get a red card, they take the red card into the paired classroom and turn over the egg timer for 3 mins and then pick up a green card and come back into the classroom. The time in the other class is entirely non confrontational and the child is ignored, giving them time to calm down or think about why they are there. When they come back it is not mentioned and we carry on as if nothing has happened. If the behaviour is repeated in the same session (not usual in Reception!) they get a warning and then a straight red card to the head. Usually putting their name on the sad face is enough to change the behaviour - the other children are usually scandalised that someone is on there and tell everyone who comes in the room! Talk about peer pressure!

[Guest]

I actually use the phrase "That is not acceptable here" with the appropriatte tone of voice and then describe why.

If a child repeats the same similar behaviour I then ask the child "Why is that not acceptable?" and encourage them to 'think for themselves' thus promoting self discipline. I also ask the child what sanction they think should result from their behaviour, the children can be quite hard on themselves.

I used to use 'time out' until a child got all the dolls out one day, lined up a row of chairs and put all the dolls on time out This childs actions made me clearly see the 'role model' we were giving.

 

I don't particularly like 'reporting' misbehaviour to parents at the end of a session as it just brings up what has already been dealt with. We do note down when a child has been spoken to and this goes in the back of their files which parents have access to. If a child displays continuous difficult behaviour I would talk to parents to find out if such behaviour also occurs at home and to discuss shared strategies to help the child change.

 

Interesting topic.

 

Peggy

[Guest]

Interesting indeed. We also use the technique of explaining that the behaviour is not desireable, and how it has made so and so sad etc, and asking if they have any ideas how to make them happy again. Which is usually really effective. The problem is when we have children with little or no English, or SEN children without the required level of understanding their actions, who are possibily misbeaving as it is a way of comunicating any way.

[Guest]

Heard an interesting news item on the radio yesterday morning along the theme of the topic - reporting that teachers now have to praise 'naughty' children as well as those who are being good - as usual the media portray totally the wrong slant and imply we're going to be praising chidlren whilst they are behaving badly.

 

We have a whole school behaviour policy that works from Nursery upwards and we talk to the children about making the wrong choice (and right choice) e.g "we don't smack people in our nursery that is the wrong choice". Idea is that children learn they are responsible for and in control of their behaviour and can choose how they behave in any situation.

 

We do have a 'time-out' space - (on a note of caution we were told on a course that you should be careful not to call it time-out) - but this is set up as a place for positive reflection - to think about making the right choice. Children are first offered a choice themselves i.e. to put right their behaviour and this is followed through with 'if you can't ... (say sorry/stop...) you will have to go on sunshine'. All our 'time-out' spaces are bright yellow mats/cushions and are referred to as sunshine mats/spaces. At the first level children are also in control of when they come back off sunshine - i.e. as soon as they are ready to make the right choice.

 

The older children use the spaces independently as well either by initiating 'time-out' for themselves when they recognise a need or by taking a peer their when they need to resolve a conflict.

[AnonyMouse_4495]

This is a very interesting discussion (yet again!)

It has got me thinking about the general way we treat children seeing as though we should be good role models...

 

We call children naughty, but we wouldn't do this to adults - behaviour would be unacceptable, so why can't it be this with children?

We smack children, but you wouldn't smack another adult - you'd get done for assault

We don't always value nappy changing times as we should - you wouldn't (shouldn't) see that in a nursing home

We impose our views and interests on children - we ask them to write when they would rather build, we ask them to do number work when they would rather play in the sand. We wouldn't impose or remove choices from adults without speaking to them, so how are children different?

 

Okay, so I know that very young children can't verbalise their interests and don't fully understand their actions or consequences but I think that as early years practitioners we have a duty to each child in our care to respect them and treat them accordingly.

 

I know the statements above are very general and not a reflection on the majority of society, but I tjust needed to rant a bit - thanks for reading!!

[Guest]

I agree Bunny -

I wouldn't want to or expect a child to treat myself or anyone else in a mannor I wouldn't like to be trated myself!

Only thorn in the issue is the hard hitting fact of life - we sometimes have to learn we can't always do as we like. The quality issue come from the practitioner in response to the child's behaviour and how they can contribut to them taking responsibilities and choices independantly in a positive fashion.

[Guest]

This topic is really intresting with so many great ideas around a problem. I would just like to add that i was told not to use a chair at all as even if you do not call it as a naughty chair the children will any way and therefore the child becomes labled. This came about when Ofsted first began the inspections, i had just taken over the running of the play group, we had a row of adult sized chairs down one side of the room, this was the childrens own space for their coats, bags etc, however should a child need time out they would be asked to sit on their chair. It was not the request to have time out but the fact that they sat on a chair which was a problem.

Todate we have no chairs as described but we do use the large cushions and bean bags for time out, Ofsted are fine with this so lose the chair and use a cushion!

[AnonyMouse_75]

we too have had parents who want us to use the naughty chair like they use at home because super nanny recomends it.. its frustrating to explain to parents that it may work at home but its not approprate in a group environment and to be honest I havent found the "time out chair" the most effective way. behaviour managment needs to be individual one shoe doesnt fit all and likewise one form of behaviour managment isnt effective for all

 

 

we tend to distract and move children to quite activities rather than use naughty chairs.

[Guest]

This is a really interesting thread with some really interesting points of views.

 

I am not being personal towards any one's appoaches here but i don't like the use of a happy or sad face (or any visual distinction between good and naughty behavious), i guess i have this one drummed into me since i first started working with children. It seems that if we place their name/picture on the sad face we are showing the whole group who has been 'naughty' and had to go on the sad face, a real way to mark that child as 'naughty' ~ sure we may not say ...has been 'naughty', but by moving their picture /name to the sad face that child (and the whole group) know they have been 'naughty.' i think its a very visual way to mark them out... i personally don't feel that the whole group and/or other parents need to know which children have been 'naughty'.

I am just thinking how demoralising it would be if i picked my child up from nursery/school and their face was on the sad face side.

 

Saying that i recognise how the smiley face can be great for positive reward systems.

 

I have no hard and fast answers to this. In our pre-school room we have a superstar star chart. each child has a shooting star with a space for 8 stars. Each day we have star chart time and stars are given for lots of things, such as hleping others, setting the table etc etc.... each day we try to assure that each child gets a star. If for some reason a child does not 'deserve' a star we will not include them in star chart time, but this segregation is not made apparent to the other children (ie we would ask child A to come and help a teacher) Child A would be reminded why they are not getting a star, but this reminding would be done out of ear shot and sight of the other children) the other children continue with star time and pay no thought to the fact that child A isn't there.

With the star chart children build up their stars over the weeks,ie full time children gain a certificate for every 8 days they attend (a star a day) for others (Iwho aren't fulltime) it may take a little longer for them to get all 8 stars. Once they have 8 stars children receive a laminated certificate and they love this The stars are then removed and they start again. I like this system because there are always children with different numbers of stars so children are nlot seen to be segregrated for being good ore naughty or anything else, but we still have a positive reward syastem in place.

 

I think at the moment we are very fortunate with our pre-school children as their behaviour is excellent. The staff have adopted an individualised approach to each child's behaviour, no staff shout and if a child needs talking to it is out of ear shot and sight of the children. Sure , sometimes there will be one or two children who do need a little reflection time and if this is the case it is handled sensitivly and discretely.

 

anyhow these are just my opinions.

 

Dawn

Edited April 15, 2007 by Guest

[Guest]

One idea I pinched from another group for positive reinforcement was a soft fluffy dog, a dog bowl and some dog biscuits. the fluffy dog gets given a name we had a Mother dog and her puppy and during the session if we had seen the chilren doing something really good we asked them to go and feed the dog 1, 2 or 3 biscuits dependent on what they had done/improved. This meant that we didn't forget to give the reward and the onus was on the child but it was not geared up to a particular child. However, we did not always get into a routine wiht this. the idea is at the end of the session is to count all the dog biscuit bones to see how they all had been so good for the session. You might want just to highlight one child's acheivements during circile time - say today Billy was able to feed the dog xx biscuits becuase he was really thoughtful and didn't push anyone off the bike or whatever. Only one thing - warn the children not to eat them. One of my veggies put her nose into the plastic box where we kept the dog biscuits - MMm these smell lovely! ?We explained that they were only for the dog but later on found her back at the table with a half eaten dog biscuit hanging out her mouth................ oh dear

I don't use naughty as I feel it is a word that can describe a lot but means little, its like that other word "nice" - both are pet hates of mine although I do use nice when my menopause kicks in and I cannot find anything else immediately - gives me a bit of time for my brain to catch up. If they are really playing up I normally take them by the hand and guide them to another acitivity where I will sit wih them for a while and talk about why is wa wrong to do what they did. Unfortunately its normally the same thing and at 4 they just lose their ability to hear - all that testosterone and they know its wrong but sometimes its just too hard to resist.

 

What a picture - so how did Ofsted take to that then!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Nikki

[AnonyMouse_6541]

Aww bless, the poor duck, what could it have possibly have done??

 

I have to say im fed up with having to prove where i have got ideas from! Its simply common sense, for all people who work with children in finding a balance between reprimanding and praise, that a child should not be labelled and should find their own identity. Its the behaviour thats not acceptable, and that is what we tell the children, we do say if its silly, or naughty when explaining, but the initial reprimand is "That is not acceptable". I also prefer to say well done, and fantastic, instead of good boy etc... noone is 100% good or bad!

 

As for the naughty spot, time out for reflection or whatever anyone else calls it, children all know when someone has mis-behaved, and are more than willing to tell everyone who will listen. The point of the time-out is often missed, but allows the child a break and hopefully a change of direction even if they dont think about what they have done.

 

Maybe we all need to re-consider where and how that should be. I tend to ask the children to have time out next to me, sat down at a table doing something, even if i dont sit them out, i often hear the other children saying so and so has been naughty.

 

I suppose the naughty step works at home as theres a very limited audience. our problem is that in the effort for consistency we use what works for the parents and most of our parents use supernannys techniques, and its quite refreshing that the parents attempt more than a choice of unrepeatable words to keep the child in line.

[AnonyMouse_4495]

I am not being personal towards any one's appoaches here but i don't like the use of a happy or sad face (or any visual distinction between good and naughty behavious), i guess i have this one drummed into me since i first started working with children. It seems that if we place their name/picture on the sad face we are showing the whole group who has been 'naughty' and had to go on the sad face, a real way to mark that child as 'naughty' ~ sure we may not say ...has been 'naughty', but by moving their picture /name to the sad face that child (and the whole group) know they have been 'naughty.' i think its a very visual way to mark them out... i personally don't feel that the whole group and/or other parents need to know which children have been 'naughty'.

I am just thinking how demoralising it would be if i picked my child up from nursery/school and their face was on the sad face side.

 

I have to say that I agree with Dawn on this one - and the point has been put across very democratically. I have chatted with colleagues at work about this thread and it has got us thinking about what we used to do, what we would advise now and what we would do with our children (none of us have children yet, so it's easy to say we wouldn't do it!)

 

The use of the happy and sad faces as well as naughty chair/time out cushion etc, we felt was open to too much subjectivity. We all had experiences of challenging children in the behaviour department and we said that what one member of staff would see as an improvement in behaviour and could warrant a reward would not be on a par with the usual good behaviour of other children - therefore do we reward the child for improving their behaviour or should we expect them to behave at the level of every other child?

 

Would a 'good' child get overlooked and not rewarded for continuous good behaviour over the 'challenging' child who still misbehaves but shows an improvement in their behavoiour? What I expect from a child is very different to the next person.

 

The same is true with traffic light systems (again, not singling out any one person's strategies) If a child was really 'naughty' would they go straight to red? I can certainly think of instances where a child has 'gone off on one', closely followed by me and I've resorted to 'extreme' measures rather than following procedures. If they behaved, would they then be promoted to amber or back to green? Again it's one person's interpretations over another.

 

I just think it's great that we can all discuss things on here in this way...