AnonyMouse_33238

You're right, it's not fair but your LA rep or local area SENCO really could help. Our LA rep recently helped us to secure funding for 10 hours per week for a little boy at our setting - he needs 1:1 support at all times. We discussed it with the parents and they were happy to agree that it was in his and everyone else's best interest for him to only attend for his funded hours so he does 9-11, 5 days a week.

Mind you, it did take us nearly a term to get to this stage - that wouldn't be possible with just two of you. I really hope your area SENCO can sort something out for you.

It seems to hinge around what finleysmaid pointed out above, i.e. that the wording of the guidance says that the LA "SHOULD ensure that if providers charge for any goods or services, for example meals, optional extras or additional hours of provision outside of the place, this is not a condition of children accessing their place."

Whereas for other points covered, the guidance says that the LA "Is required by law to ....."

As they are not legally required to enforce this point of guidance, the 'should' seems to suggest that they are not required to enforce it. And this is apparently the way that our LA sees it.

I think you are absolutely right that this shouldn't vary between LAs but there seems no doubt that it does.

Just thought I'd update and say that we asked our rep and she told us that our LA doesn't enforce the requirement and so nurseries in our area can insist on whatever they like.

Good news for settings in our area, but not so good if you're a parent looking for a place at only 15 hours per week.

this is from our local council...

The free hours can be accessed in blocks of 2.5 - 10 hours per day, between 7 am and 7 pm. The nursery decide when and how they offer the free hours, eg some offer 3 hours per day, 5 days a week, or 5 hours per day, 3 days a week or other flexible patterns. If your child attends the setting for more hours than the free entitlement, the additional charges that the provider makes are at the discretion of the provider and should be clear and transparent to parents.

 

There is no mention of the ability to ONLY take the 15 hours...so it would suggest settings can do what they like!

Although it does say "IF your child attends the setting for more hours that the free entitlement ...." - which would also seem to suggest that they should have the option not to do so? Or am I just clutching at straws? :blink:

That's what I was afraid of finleysmaid. Do you think they all just hope that no parent will ever challenge it, or is the statutory guidance like The Code in Pirates of the Carribean - more guidance than statutory?!

Our thoughts exactly. The school has a choice and must opt out of the grant if they want to insist on 20 hours per week - they can't have it both ways.

Looks like we're going to have to contact the LA and hope the SMT will listen to them! Thanks for all the advice and reassurance. I'll let you know how it goes.

Thanks everyone - I looked in the DfE's 'Early education and childcare statutory guidance for LA's' and there's a paragraph about Early Education Places for 2, 3 and 4 year olds that says:

"Ensure that if providers charge for any goods or services, for example meals, optional extras or additional hours of provision outside of the place, this is not a condition of children accessing their place. "

So we fed this back and were duly informed by the SMT that it doesn't apply to us as we're an independent school.

I'm a bit worried because I don't think that's true. It says 'Statutory guidance' - doesn't that mean it must be applied whichever LA you happen to be in or what sector you operate in? And while I totally appreciate the financial targets of the school, surely we are in danger of pricing disadvantaged children out of our high quality setting - thereby undermining the entire ethos behind nursery funding?

Hoping I'm not just being horribly naive.

I'm after some advice. We are a nursery within an independent school and we accept funding for places. Our Governors want to change the policy to insist that all 3-4 year olds attend nursery for a minimum of 20 hours per week.

We're a bit surprised by this as we were under the impression that, as we accept funding, we're obliged to provide nursery places for only 15 hours per week to enable children from all backgrounds to attend without parents having to pay any extra fees.

I can't find any information on our LA website or by trawling through google - does anybody know how we stand?

I hate to show my ignorance but what's a Video Vignette?

We have 'number detectives' - we stick numbers up around the Nursery and the children go off with clipboards to find them. We have tick sheets, tally charts or 'write the numbers you have found', depending on ability. I know ticking isn't strictly representing numbers but it allows the 2 year-olds to join in - they do love a clipboard :1b

I take it your school don't go swimming then as it's surely pretty much the same! Sounds silly to me!x

They do! But only from year 2 up.

Funny you should say that Susan, because one of the parents told us today that they are indeed going to petition the headmaster! Thanks everyone for your commiserations - I'll let you know what happens ....

Thanks mrsbat and sunnyday - at least we know we're not the only ones who think it's a shame.

And re changing nappies, that's exactly what we all said!! I think the hm has forgotten that the nursery deals with intimate care on a daily basis. Maybe we should tell him that we would be completely willing to change boys and girls separately if required, although we never have before for any of the nativity plays or other activities involving changing in the eight years I've worked there. If he thinks there may be an objection, perhaps we should start doing so?

And maybe we should also ask him if he would allow it with a parents permission form, like you say? Although I think "do you consent to members of staff towelling down your child when wet?" sound so ridiculous. How would we approach it?!

Thanks for your ideas :1b

We were all very excited yesterday when our nursery teacher brought in a paddling pool. We did a risk assessment to decide where and how, tested it out and then emailed our parents to introduce it, telling them that if they would like their child to have a splash in the pool to please send in appropriate swimwear and a towel.

As the children arrived this morning eagerly clutching their swimming gear, we got a message from the headmaster saying that the paddling pool was a definite no-no, his main issues being:

• some parents may object to boys and girls getting changed together, e.g. on religious grounds
• safeguarding issues - e.g. "towel drying children"
• apparently it doesn't give the right 'impression' (we're a private school nursery)

We honestly just saw it as an extension of our water play and didn't anticipate it causing such a storm. We had to hold up our hands to our parents this morning and say that we had jumped the gun and unfortunately the pool wasn't allowed for safeguarding reasons. They shuffled off dejectedly with the abandoned swimming bags under their arms, saying how ridiculous they thought it all was.

Wondering if anybody else has experienced similar problems and whether they managed to find a way around them?

I love the postman idea

We use a song bag - we've put a variety of song prompt items in a bag (spider, frog, potato, horse, monkey, etc) and children take turns to choose an item and think of a song with the item in. Some of our children are 2.5yrs and some 4yrs but they all absolutely love it and always want to do "one more". A lot of the songs involve a bit of 'acting out' e.g. Little Miss Muffet has to sit on his/her tuffet pretending to eat while somebody dangles the spider on a string from behind, then screams and runs back to her place when she sees it. Some songs are fast and slow, some revolve around numbers .... don't need to tell you how much you can learn when you're singing! Some children often ask for the song bag during independent play and re-enact the whole experience between themselves.

We introduce new items regularly - more for our benefit than theirs

We got ours on Amazon - there were quite a few languages to choose from :1b

Just thought I'd add that we have a male member of staff and he's a real asset. Since he joined us (as a student) we have had parents who are a bit sniffy about it on open days or when they start, so we very nicely point out that we're lucky to have him as a member of our team and remind them that they can always speak to us if they have a specific concern about any particular member of staff. We never hear any more - presumably because their children are taking home positive stories of what they've been doing with him, rather than whatever their pre-conceived ideas were.

The proof of the pudding is in the eating

Wow, well done - great outcome and her decision at the end of the day :1b

A hairband, a sycamore seed, three stones, a twig and a fruit flakes wrapper :1b

Happy new year!

I cut & pasted this from my podiatrist friend's leaflet - there's a bit about wellies right at the end. We keep a wellie rack by the door and the children change into their wellies if necessary, then back into their shoes when they come back inside. The wellie rack also adds a lovely splash of colour in the outside area

Foot health is extremely important. The foot shape and arches change enormously as your child grows, how you child stands,walks and runs will have a large impact on their knee, hip and low back health.

One major challenge to children’s foot health are the shoes they wear. Over use of high heels, thin soled shoes, studded sports shoes or very flat pumps can all contribute to problems.

Wearing high heels (anything over 2”) is especially stressful on the joints of the foot because the whole weight of the body is forced into a narrow, pointed area. High heels can contribute to knee and back problems because of the way wearers are forced to pay attention to their balance and to take shorter strides. Heels also force the thigh muscles to work harder, putting extra strain on the knee joints and tendon that runs from the knee cap to the thigh bone. (Compared with walking barefoot, high heels increase the pressure on the inside of the knee by around 26 percent and over time this increased pressure on the knee can lead to osteoarthritis).

Flat shoes are usually easier on your feet than heels, but with no shock absorbency and little heel support, there is a risk of developing a painful condition called plantar fasciitis (pain on the soles of your feet) andcalcaneal bursitis (pain under your heel). Studded football or rugby boots are often a cause of heel pain in young boys. Flip flops can also lead to similar heel problems and force the toes to claw to keep the shoe on. Even wellington boots can be a problem as they generally are less supportive than needed and can be a breeding ground for bacteria. The key is not to always wear the same shoes and where possible always try to choose good quality well fitted shoes for growing feet."

Fabulous news :1b

That's great to year - well done, Cait :1b

You could chalk a hopscotch grid or numbers with arrows for children to follow on the ground, then you can keep changing it as the rain washes it away! Our children also love being 'number detectives' - looking for numbers we've previously stuck up inside and outside. You can differentiate by making the numbers different colours to help with identification and giving a choice of ticking numbers off on a clipboard or collecting in a basket & counting up at the end. :1b